I Love Gellies

Mormonism, Evangelicism and Chaos Theory

Picture Proof: Satanic pentagrams on German Evangelisch Church

Just kidding. After reading Seth’s awesome post, I know that the pentagram isn’t really a satanic symbol,
I decided to scan this old mission picture in. Some time before my mission, I remember hearing the claims from dishonest anti-Mormons, that the pentagram was “proof” that Mormons worshipped the devil.

Inverted Pentagram on Marktkirche in Hannover, Germany

Inverted Pentagram on Marktkirche in Hannover, Germany

Marktkirche in Hannover, Germany

Marktkirche in Hannover, Germany

I remember reading some apologists, who said, essentially what Seth said, “Symbols don’t belong to anyone.” That one day, that I stepped off the train and started working my way downtown, and saw that church steeple, I knew I needed to get a picture. The church is called the Evangelische-Lutheran Pfarramt Marktkirche. Its address is Hanns-Lilje-Platz 2, 30159 Hannover, Germany. At the end of the post, I’ve included a newer video made with a digital camera (which is better than my old point and shoot).

Thanks again for the awesome post, Seth.

BTW, I’ve decided to include the Donald Duck cartoon, because, as I said, it’s at my level.

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August 8, 2009 - Posted by | Religion

16 Comments »

  1. Thanks for the hat-tip.

    How did I miss this blog?

    Sheesh… so much for my pretensions of omnipresence.

    Comment by Seth R. | August 8, 2009 | Reply

  2. Some anti-Mormons were on the radio about 20 years ago, saying the spires of the LDS Temples were designed to reach into Heaven to crucify Christ again! Yet, the Washington National Cathedral had a large amount of influence on the Architecture of the Salt Lake Temple, like the 6 spires. So, satanist at work in building Cathedrals in DC? Then, there’s the Mesa AZ, Cardston, & Hawaii Temples are way different than the other LDS temples, no “crucifying” spires there.

    That claim was so outlandish that some other well known anti-Mormons promptly & publicly distanced themselves from the Temple spires claim! I won’t name the parties on both sides, but most of you would recognize them. I guess they were afraid of all looking like fruitcakes by the claims of some.

    If you dig around other old churches & cathedrals, you will find other pentagrams, and even some stars of David, I’m sure. And, you don’t see the Cross before Constantine in Christian burial sites, or the few buildings found from that era.

    Comment by Mike H. | August 14, 2009 | Reply

  3. I have no problem naming pastors who use dishonest practices. Those who follow them should be aware of the tactics their leaders use. But I certainly won’t force you…

    Comment by psychochemiker | August 15, 2009 | Reply

  4. Since you have no problem naming Pastors who use dishonest practices:

    Ok, Walter Martin had someone named (William?) Schnoeblin on his show in the mid 80′s. Schnoeblin was supposed to be a former Christian Minister, who joined the LDS Church, as recounted in a section of the book “No More As Strangers”. But, Schnoeblin told Martin he was actually a former member of the Church of Satan, before joining the LDS Church, and said that LDS Temple spires were designed to reach into Heaven & crucify the Christ again.

    The Tanners were the ones that distanced themselves from this claim in one of their newsletters, taking Schnoeblin to task on his Satanist claims. The name of this piece was “Confessions of Syn”. I guess the Tanners were concerned of looking too far out if they supported Schnoeblin’s claims.

    Walter Martin had the knee jerk reaction of threatening Lawsuit when the Browns dug into his past in the 1980′s, and questioned Martin’s PHD claim (from a School that didn’t seem to exist!), and stated descent from Brigham Young (never charted out). So, that may have deterred others from looking into his airing Schnoeblin’s claims, but Martin is dead now.

    Also, I’ve seen that Donald Duck movie, and remember that about the geometric properties of the Pentagram.

    Comment by Mike H. | August 15, 2009 | Reply

  5. I read two of Schnoebelen’s books in high school, Lucifer Dethroned and Blood on the Doorposts. I remember, as a teenager, just thinking they were awful, ridiculous and overly sensational in every way. There’s one part in one of them where he claims that he spoke with an apostle of the LDS church who confirmed for him that Mormonism was just “Christianized Satanism.” Of course he doesn’t name which apostle supposedly told him that. The more reasonable evangelical organizations have distances themselves from him, though he still rears his ugly head here and there. The anti-Mormon pastor I spoke with on the phone a few days ago sounded like she could have been a Schnoebelen reader. Maybe I’ll revisit his books sometime.

    BTW, the school which granted Martin’s PhD did and does exist. However, it has never been accredited to grant PhD’s (though I believe it recently obtained accreditation for undergraduate degrees), and at one point the Browns wrote to it to inquire about his PhD and the school claimed to have no record of him. They later corrected this though, so apparently they had an extremely shoddy record-keeping system. California Western University (which later changed its name to California Coast University) advertised itself as a correspondence school where no classroom attendance would be required.

    Martin repeatedly claimed to have written a dissertation for his PhD, but it’s never been found and California Coast University has no information about it. He also swore under oath that he wrote a master’s thesis and this wasn’t true; his MA program at New York University did not require a thesis. He claimed on several occasions that CCU (then California Western University) was an accredited school, and he also padded his resume by claiming degrees from his college prep school (i.e. high school) and schools he only took courses from but never graduated from.

    That’s a bit of information about Martin’s degrees in a nutshell. Eventually I’m going to do a series on Walter Martin and the problem he poses for evangelical outreach to Mormons, but he has a lot of disciples among the countercult community, so I’m approaching the topic carefully.

    Comment by Bridget Jack Meyers | August 16, 2009 | Reply

  6. Thanks, Jack. I never did hear the further details of those issues. At least you have the sense to be objective about the critics!

    Comment by Mike H. | August 16, 2009 | Reply

  7. Simple minded fools. The pentagram is a Satanic symbol from pre greek empirism. Reaching back 1,000 years before any notable civilization. Ice age peoples were well aware of the five pointed star before any Freemason, since Freemasonry evolved from occult and Satanic teachings 2,000 years before the xtian movement. Sounds like Seth needs a history lesson.

    Comment by Thoth Murmur | October 31, 2009 | Reply

  8. Sounds like you need a Valium Thoth.

    I’ll be sure to file that info away under my “history-according-to-random-internet-guy” file.

    Comment by Seth R. | October 31, 2009 | Reply

  9. So Thoth. Are the Lutherans who worship in this church all satanists? Please teach us history, you sound like a highly intelligent individual. Please tell us your denomination, where you get your history from, and where in the bible we are told a pentagram is satanic?

    Comment by psychochemiker | November 2, 2009 | Reply

  10. one name will explain: william cooper

    Comment by robin | December 2, 2011 | Reply

  11. The upside down pentagram is pretty much considered evil. It’s used to conjur demons for one. having one point pointing upward makes it safe.

    Comment by brandon | April 11, 2012 | Reply

  12. Brandon, read the link to my article in the post above before commenting.

    Comment by Seth R. | April 11, 2012 | Reply

  13. Check it out in the Necronomicon. The Book of the Names of the Dead.

    http://www.schlock.net/tng47s.html

    Comment by brandon | April 11, 2012 | Reply

  14. No, this one lols.

    http://www.orrar.net/occult/necronomiconseal.htm

    Comment by brandon | April 11, 2012 | Reply

  15. The link up above is bad, Seth. You might want to check on that..Not Found

    The requested URL /2009/08/06/joseph-and-the-amazing-misunderstood-pentagram/ was not found on this server.

    Comment by brandon | April 11, 2012 | Reply

  16. Ah, that blog had a crash at one point and had to redo a lot of its articles. Here’s a working link:

    http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=990

    Comment by Seth R. | April 11, 2012 | Reply


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